SPEAKER_00 0:04

You're listening to the Hangin with the AD Podcast, where we break down hot topics in athletic administration and lessons learned through leadership. Now, here are your hosts, Josh Matthews and Don Baker.

SPEAKER_03 0:18

Welcome back to another episode of the Hangin' with the AD Podcast. It's been a minute. We're glad to be back with you. We are headed to the natural state to sit down with Matt Whiting, the Director of Athletics at the University of Central Arkansas. Since stepping into the lead chair in 2024, Matt has been navigating the challenge of following a longtime athletic director, leading through one of the most transformational periods in college athletics and helping shape the future of the Bears athletic department. Before taking the top role, Matt spent nearly eight years at UCA as Associate Athletic Director for External Affairs and began his journey at his alma mater University of Arkansas at Monticello, building a career rooted in relationships, strategic growth, and servant leadership. In this conversation, we dive into leadership transitions, decision making in the era of NIL, the transfer portal, facility management, AI, and leadership, and what today's challenging collegiate landscape means for the next generation of student athletes. Matt gives us an honest look at the realities of leading in the big chair and the intentional habits leaders need to grow to adapt and stay effective. If you're an athletic administrator, coach, or educational leader trying to navigate change while staying grounded in purpose, this is an episode you won't want to miss. Now let's settle in and get to know Matt Whiting.

SPEAKER_02 1:59

Yeah, Josh, thank you. I appreciate you guys having me on. Been looking forward to this and uh just excited about it today.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

Yes, sir. So for our listeners, Matt Whiting is a director of athletics at the University of Central Arkansas. Matt's been in this position since about 2024. Uh prior to sitting in the lead chair there, Matt served at UCA as the associate director of external affairs for about eight years. He started his career at his alma mater at the University of Arkansas Monticello before that, though. You may ask, well, how did we get this guy? Well, for one, I recently took a trip to Arkansas, uh, my first trip uh through I think the natural state there. And on the way back, we made a quick trip through uh the UCA campus, and it was so nice. I was telling my wife and uh our son, I was like, Well, we I I need to talk, we need to talk to this guy. He's he's doing things right around here. So uh that was one way. And then called uh one of our Arkansas contacts, our friend Dustin Smith. And of course, he has a great relationship with Matt and his family, just like he does with everybody in Arkansas and Oklahoma. So he connected us. So we're great, we're gracious to have uh you joining us today, Matt. Um we're gonna get better, we're gonna learn from you and let you uh make us better athletic leaders today, and we appreciate that. But we'll stop right here and let you tell us a little bit more about yourself. Uh, we call it the back of the baseball card bio. So stop for a minute. I know you're a baseball guy. Tell us some back of what Matt Whiting's baseball card will look like.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

Yeah, no, absolutely, Josh. That's a that's a good question. You know, never thought about that, but love the love the baseball analogy for sure. So um, yeah, you know, I'm I'm a former uh student athlete, played baseball in college, uh, spent two years at the junior college level and then two at the Division II level. And that's actually how I met Dustin. Uh Dustin was the athletic director at the University of Arkansas at Fort Smith when I was playing baseball there. And at the time, UA Fort Smith was a part of the University of Arkansas system, but still junior college athletics. And so got to know Dustin there and uh really had a had just a great time, great experience at UA Fort Smith. Played played my two years there and uh then went back to the University of Arkansas at Monticello to play two years and um just very thankful for for everything that that college athletics taught me and uh and afforded me in the opportunities to be exposed to an athletic department and uh it was just great for me. And and you know, I think it's interesting for a lot of student athletes. Um, I know for me especially, and have had this conversation with several student athletes on our campus, that um, you know, when you're a student athlete, I don't think you really understand everything that goes on in an athletic administrative office. And, you know, uh I was fortunate enough to to get some exposure, but I still didn't have have have great understanding. And so finished up my playing career and and uh undergraduate career and and um went to the University of Arkansas at Little Rock to get my MBA. And um, you know, I I thought at the time I wanted to coach uh college baseball. And so I spent my first year at Little Rock as a grad assistant with the baseball program there and uh was a great experience for me. Uh uh uh, you know, having a chance to stay around the game and and uh experience coaching and and kind of see things from that lens and and really enjoyed that experience, but I also learned at that time that that you know life outside of the white lines is a lot different than life inside of it. And so uh had a chance uh in my second year in graduate school to get exposed to athletics development a little bit more and actually, you know, university advancement at the University of Arkansas at Little Rock. And so um really enjoyed that, uh really enjoyed seeing a little bit more into uh, you know, what athletics administration is and uh finished up my my uh my MBA and and uh had a wonderful opportunity to go back to Monticello. It was a new position that was being uh created at the time. It was assistant athletic director for external relations and was really charged with uh developing and creating a fundraising program for uh Arkansas Monticello Athletics and um was a great experience for a young, you know, 24-year-old at the time to be able to jump into that. Uh had spent a lot of time around that campus, was was had obviously had some connections with the athletic director there and and folks in the community, and spent right at four years at at uh Monticello in that role. And and again, it was just a great experience for me because I learned a lot of what does not work in in athletics fundraising, some of a lot of what works, and had a chance to kind of you know fall on my face. But ultimately we had some success and and uh were able to do some do some positive things there on that campus. And and um uh again, just a great experience. And you know, I mean, anytime you're you're at uh uh I'm gonna say Division II or or I mean even for us here at Central Arkansas, we're certainly a smaller administrative staff, but you know, you you your focus is fundraising, but you're exposed to so many other things. You're exposed to marketing, you're exposed to game operations, you're exposed to, you know, uh streaming and broadcast, you're exposed to ticketing and all of those things. And so had the chance to get uh a lot of experience there. Very grateful to Chris Ratcliffe, who was the athletic director at UAM at the time and the the opportunities he afforded me. And um, so right at four years there, and and um then I had a chance to come to the University of Central Arkansas and and work for a great athletic director and uh Dr. Brad Teague. Um Brad was was um Brad was the athletic director here for 17 years, and uh prior to that, he was the athletic director at Delta State and uh you know came here in in 2016 and um had a chance to it was assistant AD for development when I first started at UCA. And over time, I was just very fortunate that he continued to put more responsibility on my plate, uh expose me to you know even more things and advanced my skill set and uh fast forward eight years had advanced to associate athletic director for external relations, overseeing our marketing, our ticketing, development, sponsorship, creative services, and broadcast production arms. And um, you know, 2024 comes around, and and um we were starting a uh aviation academy here at the University of Central Arkansas. And so Brad, uh former athletic director, is also a pilot. And um, you know, I I think everybody can see in college athletics that the sayings have shifted in the last several years, a lot of a lot of changes and and had had uh it's been a long career here, and and he had a wonderful opportunity to step into lead our uh aviation academy as it was being developed and and and starting and all that, and certainly a passion of his is aviation. So um I was very fortunate to be in a position, thanks to him, to you know, the the opportunities and and things that he afforded me during my time here to to have a chance to be uh to be promoted, to fill his spot as athletic director, and very grateful uh for again for to him for all that he is he uh the experiences that he provided for me and and also our our our president here, Dr. Houston Davis, and the trust that he had in me to step into this role. And so since July of 2024, I've been serving as as uh athletic director uh here at Central Arkansas and again just very, very thankful, very grateful for the opportunity. We have 18 sports, um 450 student athletes, uh Division I compete in the Atlantic Sun Conference in all sports uh except for football. We compete in the United Athletic Conference. However, we are making uh some changes. The A Sun and UAC have formed a consortium. So uh all of our sports, uh, including football would will join the UAC beginning July 2026, with the exception of two that will remain in the A Sun, and that's men's soccer and beach volleyball, just the way the uh sport portfolio breakdown uh in those two leagues uh come together. But again, just grateful for the the chance to be here um and uh appreciate you guys having me on. I hope Josh that that provides a little context, a little bit, a little bit of look into uh my role and my my experiences so far in athletics.

SPEAKER_01 10:02

Uh that's really great. I mean, a couple points I think I'm glad you made that I think are just ironic or are neat to pull out. Beach volleyball in Central Arkansas. That's uh it's probably uh you know not not the most thought-of sport in central Arkansas. Um the conference realignment that we see on ESPN in the big conferences is not just happening in the in the big four, it's happening at your level as well. So that's uh I guess a uh a ripple effect of what's happening at the higher level. So you're going through some of those same things. And then I did want to just go back and uh ask my first question based on what you said about working uh the transition there with Brad Teague, a longtime athletic director. That's interesting. You you know, you you don't know what someone's hidden talents or or certifications or whatever you want to call it are, but uh you know, probably don't think of many athletic directors being pilots and going from being athletics to aviation. I did say that he uh went that route, but I didn't dig into it enough to know he had his pilot's license. So that's pretty neat to learn something behind the scenes there. But uh going back to that, uh you mentioned him and you assumed this role a couple years ago, as you mentioned, Brad had been there for 17 years. That's a long time at one place, especially in this profession, whether it's at the college level, high school level. Uh, we I don't think we stay in this role for that long most of the time. There's no doubt he had a lot of great things going there. He probably had a lot of strong relationships that he had developed uh during his tenure there. So I want to ask you to start with I think this is a good question for the new ADs who are in new places right now, or maybe when they listen to it, they'll be in a new place, or someone transitioning to follow a great leader. What was the key for you to successfully navigate the transition of following a longtime leader who you mentioned is really a big time leader?

SPEAKER_02 11:58

Yeah, that's a great question, Josh. And and to even take that a step further, you know, Brad assumed the role as uh director of the Aviation Academy. Um, he also and let me say this first. In in in most AD transitions, it's it's typically, you know, the the the former AD is taking another role, and so they're out of the picture. Right. Or they're there maybe something happened, and and and either way you look at it, they're they're out of the picture, right? And so, you know, Brad is still in Conway, and uh part of his his new role with the university is director of aviation academy. He also is a professor in our sport management uh uh graduate program here, but he also senior advisor to athletics. And so, you know, it it's it's really unique. And I think a lot of what has allowed us to be successful is the relationship that he and I had. Um, I think the the the relationship that we had very strong. Uh, we're very similar. Um, I think that we work extremely well together. And so, you know, I was fortunate to be in in the role that I was prior for eight years and learn from him and see, you know, and I think in in any any job that you work, you're all whoever your superior is, you're always going to see things that you think, hey, in that situation, I would probably do the same thing, or hey, in that situation, I may may think about doing something a little different. But he's a fantastic leader. Uh, again, afforded me so much opportunity. And I think that just the working relationship that we had um allowed us to really make the transition very smooth. I think that being here for eight years and kind of being involved in in a lot of the things that under his tenure that uh you know were successful, uh uh allowed me to have just some institutional knowledge and understanding of kind of the way things operate. And and again, just the working relationship that that he and I shared, uh, I think allowed us to make that transition very smooth. And then taking it a step further in his advisory role, um, it's been a huge resource for me as a young athletic director. When you have somebody that's got, you know, 20, 21 years of experience of sitting in the AD chair um to to uh call on and say, hey, especially 17 years at the institution here that that I'm at now, to call on and say, hey, why'd you do it this way? You know, can you explain that to me? Um, or you know, just to bounce ideas off of. Um, I think that's unique. And again, uh, you know, in in most situations, an AD transition, they're they're they're going, they're they're going out either way you look at it. So to have him here, tremendous, you know, invaluable resource for me. Um, just very grateful for that. And again, I think it goes back to being able to make that transition is just you know, being willing to to ask questions, to, to, to lean on that person. Of course, I'm fortunate to have the opportunity that he's still, you know, in in the Conway community and and and willing to take my phone calls. But um, that's good. You know, I think I think uh the fact that we have we had a strong working relationship really allowed us to be successful in that transition.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

Yeah, that's a great answer. I don't think many people would have expected you to say, go get the old guy, and I use that relative, right? But I mean that's the the previous guy and put him in an advisory role. And obviously being local, that helps out. But that's a that's a great answer that I think is really unique. Now, one question with the aviation program y'all started, I was just on the University of Florida's athletic website. We have a friend in their content creation. So I was looking at her bio, but as I'm scrolling through their staff directory, it's pretty, pretty deep, right? And they have an aviation department in their athletic program, pilots and mechanics. So now does Central Arkansas have an aviation uh department in their athletic program with a former AD uh over the program?

SPEAKER_02 15:43

You know, we we don't have an aviation department within athletics, but but the fact that Brad is a pilot uh does uh provide some some some really you know really great opportunities for us if we need to get somewhere uh pretty quickly and and uh you know and and and again and and working with him for the eight years that I did. Um he's he he was uh I've taken several trips with him. So we don't have an actual aviation department within athletics, but uh it's certainly a unique resource to have your former athletic director, a pilot still around and and uh on on a on short notice be able to take a trip if we need to.

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Haven't bought the plane yet, but you got the pilot ready. That's right. That's right. That's good, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:24

Good deal. Now, Matt, we recently had Kellen Lee, the mental performance coach for the Seattle Mariners on the podcast, and he offered a really interesting distinction between routines and superstitions. Um he said routines are intentional behaviors that prepare you for future performance, while superstitions are explanations why that we lean on after the fact when things don't go the way that we plan. Okay. Now, as a long time baseball guy like Josh, uh I'm sure that you have seen and maybe even practiced your fair share of superstitions over the years. Um, but as an athletic director, you have to operate at a much higher level where efficiency, clarity, and consistency really matter. First, do you agree with Kellen's perspective on that difference between routines and superstitions? And then secondly, can you speak to leaders about the danger of maybe holding on to certain habits or ways of doing things simply because they're comfortable, not necessarily because they're effective, uh, and how that mindset can limit growth and prevent leaders from reaching an elite level.

SPEAKER_02 17:25

Yeah, Don, uh great question. Uh, you know, I I I do I do agree with with uh with with what was shared there related to routines and superstition. And it's hard as a former baseball player. I I certainly have some superstition superstitious tendencies, if you will. Yep. Um and and you know, it's easy, you know, to hop into routines and and all that. I think I think one of the things that that I've learned, I'm gonna take a stab at answering this. I I think in this role, you're pulled in so many different directions, right? And so, yeah, you like to create some routine um with within your schedule and and and all of those things. It's it's challenging to do because you are, you know, you're pulled across campus, you're pulled into to, again, we have 18 sports and and you know, working with our head coaches directly, you're pulled into a lot of different things. And so, you know, uh certainly uh for me, some sort of routine is helpful to be able to stay on task and stay on schedule with what we need to accomplish. Um, but I think from a leader standpoint, you know, one of the things we talk about with our staff and I share with our staff is that I I don't want you to always agree with me. We we can't we can't continue to be successful if you're always agreeing with me and if we're we're doing things the same way each and every day. I think we always have to push each other and realize that, hey, there's growth that sure, if we've done things a certain way and it's been successful, maybe let's let's let's look at those, but let's always be willing to to look at new ideas. And so um, you know, you don't you don't want to get bogged down and get caught in that routine or being, you know, thinking that just because you've done it a certain way over and over that it that that's the only way to be successful. And so as a leader, you know, for us as we built out the staff here at Central Arkansas, um, we wanted to be sure that we tried to add people that would challenge kind of that that thought. And and um, you know, how can we how sure how how can we do things that that make sense for us? Maybe there's some tweaks here or there to be successful, stay on task, to accomplish what we have to accomplish. But let's not be afraid to to throw new ideas out there and kind of get out of our comfort zone, if you will, because I heard Inky Johnson say this when he was on on our campus a few years back. He said, the comfort zone's a great place, but nothing grows there. And and you know, I really, really love that quote. It it always stuck with me. But um, I think you have to be willing to stretch yourself as a leader. Sure, you want to have some routine to keep things functioning, keep things normal, but you have to be willing to stretch yourself uh for growth, and and certainly something that you know uh is important for for us here at Central Arkansas.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Yeah, it's really good. I love that Inky Johnson quote. That's that's good stuff, nothing grows there. Um, man, that's um yeah, the superstitions. I sit there and I'm I'm watching a game and I'm like, man, I I can't move, we're doing good. And then I realize, hey, you gotta go deal with something. You're the you're the the athletic administrator on duty, go deal with it. You gotta move, you know.

SPEAKER_03 20:16

You need toilet paper in the bathroom.

SPEAKER_01 20:17

That's right. That's right. Yeah, exactly. You got to do it. Get get out of those superstitions. Uh Matt, I'm gonna ask you a little bit about I'm gonna highlight a specific thing within your athletic department, but it's not really what we want to talk about. And I'll uh I'll explain it. But I found it very interesting to read that your UCA athletic department opted in to the U.S. house settlement. If people don't know what we're talking about, they go look it up. Uh, but it's basically schools, athletic departments getting money uh for athletics. I don't think I realized it was an option to opt in or opt out. I don't, you know, we just hear what hear what we hear on on the news. Some might ask, you know, why would you opt out of millions of dollars? But also imagine there are many details that get left left out when big decisions are handed down like that when it's presented to the public, right? The generic public like me. Uh, I state that one specific case, not to elaborate on it, but really as I read it, I thought about all the subtle details that the general public never learns and how those affect the administration of something that seems to be a no-brainer, at least publicly. Talk about decision making and how you really determine what initiatives and additions really do provide, in your words, a great athletics experience and ensure the long-term health and stability of our programs. You know, I think of that last part stability. When I go into some gyms, whenever I go watch a game or whatever, and I see banners, just a whole bunch of hodgepodge banners. Not to not to get negative about people, but you can just tell the stability wasn't taken into place when they put the put their banners up, right? Uh I think that's kind of what you meant, but but in in terms of programs and such as such as that within an athletics department. Talk about that a little bit if you don't mind.

SPEAKER_02 22:09

Yeah, Josh. Great, great question. So, you know, the house settlement is uh intriguing. I mentioned at the beginning that, you know, college athletics has really evolved tremendously.

SPEAKER_01 22:19

That's the biggest understatement of this whole podcast, by the way.

SPEAKER_02 22:22

That's right. No, I agree. Uh I often oftentimes I've joked with Brad that, you know, a great time to get into aviation. I don't know if it's the best time to be an athletic director at the at the college level, but now again, very grateful for the opportunity here. But so it's it's changed tremendously. And in this past year, I mean, there were there were major changes. You know, the house settlement. Um, you know, if you go back when the NCAA agreed to settle on on this case, I mean, going back into the fall of 2024, you know, I've been in this position now for right at about four or five months. Um in October, I think it was announced that uh, or maybe it was maybe it was earlier in the year, maybe about a month into my tenure, that that it was agreed to that the NCAA was going to settle this case, large lawsuit against the NCAA. It's a $2 billion lawsuit. And so some major changes coming to college athletics. And so the the three biggest changes in the house settlement are one, you can now share revenue with with student athletes. NIL's been a thing for however many years now, but it's always had to be outside of your athletic department through a third party, a collective, or what have you. And so that's one big change. The second is roster limits. And so, you know, now with the house settlement, you have to adhere to these roster limits. Um, you can go, you can be below the roster limit, but or at the number, but you can't be above it. And so uh, and then finally the third thing or the traditional NCAA Division I scholarship limits. Now you can offer uh all sports become equivalency sports, but now you can also offer the the number of scholarships that you and your institution are willing to invest. For the longest time, there was a cap on that number. So for us, we participate in FCS football at 63 scholarships at football, baseball's 11.7, men's basketball is 13, women's basketball is 15. So those traditional scholarship limits through this house settlement were now done away with. Now, I'm gonna go back to the 24-25 year, and as we're going through this year, you know, the the the final it was agreed that the initial proposal, initial settlement proposal was kind of starting to be discussed in the fall of 24, but the final settlement hearing was was scheduled for April 7th, 2025. And so as we get in, and of course, myself, uh, I mentioned we have a phenomenal president here, Dr. Houston Davis, who's on the NCAA board of directors, so very much involved uh in the NCAA. Great insight uh for me as a young athletic director. There's a lot of information that he's able to gain access to that that allows us to make good, strong strategic decisions for us here at Central Arkansas. And so as we go through the year, we're we're we're following this, right? We're trying to determine what is best for the University of Central Arkansas. And every Division I institution was asked to, we had to make a decision are we going to opt in or opt out to the settlement terms for the 25-26 year? And so as we're going through that process, you know, again, one of the the key things for us, and I think it's important for every institution and in any decision you make, you know, there's there's certainly things that are shifting at the national level and all across the landscape of college athletics, but you also you got to still keep in mind you've got to make decisions that are that are best for your institution, for your you know, situation that you have. And so um as as you as we work through that year again, we had to make a decision by March 1 to declare our intent whether you opt in or opt out for 25, 26, um, which was interesting to me. We're make we're declaring our intent to something that's not officially approved by the judge yet. Uh that was supposed to be on April 7th, um, which was pushed into to June. It was, I think the final approval was granted on June June 6th or June 7th. So the house settlement becomes real. And so we we at the time had declared our intent to opt out for this academic year. And the reason for that was we wanted to be sure that we were we were putting Central Arkansas in the best position to be successful and making sure that we were making it making a decision that was best for UCA, but also a decision that we could do and and and create some long-term sustainability behind, right? You know, we had to had to had to really do some things on our campus, uh, had to make some some strategic decisions. We we discontinued a sport at the end of last spring. Um, and uh we also knew that there was some conference realignment coming for us, so some strategic decisions to better position UCA um you know to make it make ultimately a decision about the house settlement. So we the settlements approved in June, and and we ultimately declared, we ultimately made the decision June 30th that we were opting out for 25-26, wanted to see where this landscape was going, evaluate things, again, put a plan in place that we felt sustainable here and was best for us at UCA. And so ultimately that's what we we started working on. And and you know, I we have uh an athletics all staff meeting at the end of July every year as we're going into a new academic year. And as you can imagine, uh, you know, being a young athletic director in year one, you're dealing with this, and you've got coaches that are you know wanting to know, and of course, they're talking to their friends and colleagues in the business, wanting to to see what other institutions are doing. And and every institution's got a different viewpoint on it. So, you know, you're having to navigate those those conversations and and and again keep keep the at the forefront of our mind what is right for UCA, what's best for us, what what is what is what is good for us at the end of the day. So um I shared at our July all staff meeting that you know while we have opted out for 25-26, we're we're don't, you know, we're continuing to monitor things, build a plan, make sure that we're in the best position for us. And so through work with the president um and also Brad as senior advisor, we we we were putting a plan in place, making sure that what we needed to do was was best for us to be uh sustained competitively at the division one level. And uh I also shared in that all-staff meeting that my hope is that while we opted out for 25-26, that doesn't mean that we we don't opt out for 20, or we opt we opt in for 26-27, which ultimately we've decided to do. And I share that I know that you know that's that's big decisions within each of your sports, uh, talking to our coaches um and and and big changes. You talk about the roster limits uh, you know, that that that we may have to alter. And so um I said I shared with them that my hope is that if if we make that decision to opt in, I can inform you by October or November of 2025 so that we can, you know, we can prepare and plan effectively for the 26-27 academic year. And ultimately, um again, going back to those strategic decisions we had to make on our campus from a sport portfolio offering, conference realignment, um, and and and continuing to see where the the the sands of were shifting of of college athletics, we we felt that it was important for us to to go ahead and declare that intent to opt in for 26-27, begin revenue sharing uh with our student athletes. And um, but what I'm so proud of as we work through that is that we put a plan in place that we feel is is right for Central Arkansas. Um, and I think we're in an era of college athletics that it's it's it's challenging, right? I mean, it's that it's a lot about financial uh you know support and all those things. And so we took our time to make sure we were in the best place for us, and and hopefully it's a big change uh on our campus, but but all of our coaches are very excited about it. And again, I think the key thing is we wanted to be strategic about it and make make a decision that's that's in the best interest of Central Arkansas. So, Josh, that's a long-winded answer, but I hope a little insight and and um uh answered your question there.

SPEAKER_01 30:10

Yeah, absolutely. I think for the ones of us who don't deal with a house settlement, strategic planning takes time, takes reflection, takes collaboration. Um, you've got you've got to you know get some more margin time. You can't make strategic decisions in the hustle and bustle. And I think I can pull out that you've given this a lot of thought and probably some dedicated time along. Uh, and then the biggest moral to that answer is you've got to make the right decision for your school and you gotta do all those things I just mentioned that you kind of gave us specifics on. Collaboration's the big one and and and and and reflection. So yeah, I think that's a great way to help us know how to make big decisions, not just get activity accomplished throughout every day. That's good.

SPEAKER_03 31:00

Yep. I think it's kind of piggyback on that too. And we've talked about this on here before. I I've heard it even in the military, you're they make decisions, they don't have all the information, right? You're you're making a strategic decision with anywhere between 40 and 70 percent of the information. So there's still a lot of unknown there, but you have to be strategic with the information that you have, and then being able to have your own crystal ball to go, what is the best way for us to do this long term? And so I think there's a ton there. Now, let's shift to leadership for a moment. You have now been sitting in that big chair and had your name on the letterhead for over a year, and before that, you had a front row seat to watching two different athletic departments operate under different leadership styles. How would you describe where you are today in your leadership philosophy? And has the reality of leading day-to-day in that top role matched what you expected, or has your perspective evolved since stepping into that chair?

SPEAKER_02 31:58

Yeah, Don, that's uh I'll take a stab at that. That's a great question. So I, you know, for me, my my leadership style has always been, you know, uh just some true noise for me or integrity, uh, doing the right thing. Um, you know, I my mom always shared that integrity is doing the right thing when nobody's looking right. And so, you know, I I've always tried to keep that at the forefront of my mind and when when we make decisions and and you know, what is right? What is what is right versus what is wrong, what's right for our institution, what's right for our student athletes, what's right for our coaches, uh, and and knowing that you're probably going to upset people in in all of the decisions that you make. And that's just part of it, right? You mentioned, you know, having sometimes when you make decisions, you don't have all of the information at your disposal, but you gotta, you know, I've always tried to think about what long term is right for for us as a department, what what long term is right for our student athletes and all those things. So, you know, for me it's about integrity, uh doing things the right way. And and then also, you know, one of the things that I I hope that I emulate uh in in my job is that for our staff, um, I always I always talk about that that or I I internally I you know have self-discussions with myself is that I always want to show our staff that I'm willing to do whatever it is or I've done whatever it is that that may be asked of them. And also, you know, to me going to games. I mean, again, I think for me that's important to show our staff that I'm there to support them. Um, I want our staff to know that that I'm I'm willing to do anything and everything that's being asked of them or I've done it and and and and so on and so forth. So it's showing up and being present uh with our coaches, with our student athletes, with our staff, uh again, trying to lead by what I think is a positive example, uh what I was able to witness from from two athletic directors that I worked for, uh, I think it's really important. And so um to me, I I try to go back to those two things integrity, doing things the right way, and leading by example are really important for me when I when I think about my leadership style. And then, you know, to ask to answer the question about uh has it been, you know, is it easy to live that through? Um it it's challenging, right? I mean, I think I mentioned earlier on on the on the call that you know you're pulled in a lot of different directions uh uh as an athletic director. And so um that's that's hard in in one part because you know you you have a lot of different balls in the air that you have to keep in the air and make decisions related to a lot of different things and go from task to task. And so you're you're pulled in a lot of different directions. There's there's a lot of interests that are asking or people that are asking questions of you with various interests, so you have to kind of decipher and decode what is what what's right, right? What's right for our our department, what's right for our student athletes. And so um it's it's challenging in that regard because you are you're pulled in a lot of different directions. And the second thing I would add to that is it easy to do. I think that, you know, um one of the things for me and stepping into this role, you know, as a as an associate athletic director before, sure, you you you have a chance to be exposed to a lot of decisions, but ultimately you're not the end decision maker. You know, you you're there to support the the athletic director and provide advice, provide guidance and all those things, but you're not the one that is is having to make the final decision. And so now being in that chair, you know, it's a different, it's it's kind of looking through a different lens. And um, you know, I I uh I think that you have to you you you prepare yourself in a way to try to take on a role and you know, you think about your leadership style, those things that have always kind of molded you and built you and what you want to do when you get in that position. And sure, you got to follow through with them. But until you until you're in that chair and making those decisions, you don't really understand the pressure. Um, you don't understand, you know, really maybe all aspects of that decision, you know, in in a regard, because you're you you're you're looking at you know a lot of information and you're as uh in the athletic director chair, you got to think about a lot of different things about how that impacts your department, how that impacts your student athletes, your coaches. And so, you know, while you prepare yourself and you say you're ready, I don't think you're ever ready until you you get a chance to experience that. And uh again, for me, it's just I I hope to to always in my mind keep those things, you know, lead by example and and and do what's right, do you know, lead with integrity. So um that's that's really important to me from a leadership standpoint.

SPEAKER_03 36:19

Yeah, I think that's like when I remember when we had our oldest, and the nurse called me over and she she flipped his foot upside down and she goes, Now you see, there are no instructions on the bottom of this foot. Like you you are on your own. After we leave here today and you leave this hospital, you are on your own. You say you're you don't really, you think you know, but you don't know until you're actually having to do it. Um, and I think my follow-up to that was if if we asked your staff what does it look like to be led by you, do you think that their answer would align with your philosophy? And do you believe you're living it out? I think you do. And you mentioned that idea about you alluded to um creating a safe space for the people that are on your team to share their opinions and thoughts, even if they're different from what you have to maybe we uh collectively we're better together. Who are your truth tellers? Who who are those people that that are kind of in your circle that you bounce things off of outside of just you know you looking at yourself in the mirror and having those conversations with yourself like we all do?

SPEAKER_02 37:23

Yeah, no, absolutely. Well, you know, I I've talked about Brad a lot uh on on the call, and and he's certainly, I mean, he's he's you know, he's been a mentor of mine, and and just again, watching him for for the eight years that I worked for him have a chance to to see how he made decisions. Uh and and I I value his input, right? And and he's just a he's he's a fantastic leader, was was a phenomenal person to work for, a great friend of mine. And so he's certainly one of my wife, uh my wife Johanna, who ironically works for Dustin uh when when when my wife played golf at UA Fort Smith. And so Bless her heart.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

Bless her heart.

SPEAKER_02 37:59

That's right, Josh. Yeah, so she worked. And so, you know, uh I I think that you know, a lot of people well let me say this. When it comes to working in college athletics, I think that, you know, uh I think a lot of people don't realize the strain and the stress that it puts on your family, right? I think that, you know, uh it it it certainly does. And so, you know, for all of us that are in it, you you you certainly you you probably don't understand it at the time, but but we we all outkicked our coverage to marry somebody that's that's you know willing to to live that lifestyle with you and be supportive of you and all those things. So I certainly lean on my wife. Uh she is just a a very uh uh strong uh woman and and and very uh provides a lot of sound leadership for me and and and helps me to see it from a different perspective because she's not living it every day in in the way that I the way that I uh you know have to have to do it. But she's just she's she's just uh always, you know, uh she's not afraid to check me and and I appreciate that and just be you know be willing to provide some good advice and and and uh help me, even while she's not in this business, help me kind of look at it and stay in that lens of what's right, what's what's what's doing the right thing for for our our athletic department. So certainly her and and uh you know uh Chris Ratcliffe has has been a tremendous, uh tremendous friend of mine. I worked for him at Monticello. I think Chris is uh he's a he does it with integrity and so always always grateful for his input and advice. Um and and you know, there's there's several other colleagues that I've worked with uh through the years that that just you know I I think you gravitate towards because of probably you think a lot in the same way, but also as you see them do their roles and their tasks, that you you see that they do it with integrity and and uh try to lead by example. And so uh those are just a couple for me that that that have been instrumental in my career. And I mentioned our our president here at the University of Central Arkansas. I mean, he is he's just a great leader and um amazing to see, you know, working in college athletics, his ability to to really lead our institution. And and uh me as a young athletic director mentioned his his his roles with the NCAA are just incredibly insightful for me as as we continue to navigate a challenging environment.

SPEAKER_01 40:12

That's good, really good. I I like that um line you you just talk about your wife, and I wrote down it's the what's right lens. I think that's cool having her to be able to have that lens for you, the the what's right lens. That's that's that's good. I think I'm I'm the same way, but um I think that's a huge compliment to have someone, especially being your wife there. So um I I mentioned our trip through the UCA campus back in November. We had gone out to see Dustin and came back. And my wife, uh to be honest, my wife has embraced my hobby of visiting Division I campuses. Uh I think y'all were 104, 105, or something like that. So uh finally got through Arkansas to see a couple of universities. Uh, but sometimes it can make for a long drive home. You know, oh well, I guess that's part of it, but that's just what we do. What we were really uh impressed with, and I mentioned this earlier, were the were the facilities. Uh y'all, y'all got some great things there that probably a lot of people don't know about. How do you prioritize the facilities where they are being maintained, evaluated, and updated in a fashion that allows for good budgeting, but also in a fashion that keeps a safe and attractive place for your athletes and your prospective athletes? Obviously, you got you got to get kids to come there and facilities is a part of that, uh, but you can't do it all at once, right? And I think this is a kind of a nuts and bolts kind of athletic director question, but we all deal with it. Do we just give it all the football or do we have some kind of schedule to get things maintained, evaluated, and updated uh on on a special schedule? How do you do that? Y'all y'all have great plan uh facilities and we were we were really impressed.

SPEAKER_02 41:58

Well, thank you, Josh. I appreciate that. Certainly biased, but very proud of of our campus and and uh here at Central Arkansas and Conway in general. It's a great place to be. Um, you know, that that's that's tough, right? And and you you know, in this era of college athletics, uh, I think you're seeing, I mean, this this conversation is being discussed at at the highest levels of college athletics. I mean, is it for the longest time it's always been a facility's arms race, right? How do you build the biggest, greatest, best, you know, whatever's next uh facility? Well, well, that's shifted. Where where are those funds needed now? Well, the funds are needed in in in revenue sharing and and uh you know, but you also you still have to maintain, right? You still have to maintain your facilities uh because you wanna you wanna uh uh make sure that that that that you have what you need. And and as with anything, it takes upkeep. I mean, there's always things that that uh come up and break or you have to fix and and repair and all that. So it's tough. Uh I I think for us, um, you know, uh I've mentioned several people, our president. Uh we we've got great, great folks on campus, great people on our campus on my staff here at UCA that that take a lot of pride in what we have. And so we always try to try to keep that um at the forefront of our mind. We want to be we want to make sure that we take pride in our facilities, we take care of those, and we we do what we can. Now, do we have every dollar? Do we have all the resources? No, we don't. But how do we how do we make it the best with what we have and always ensure that we're we're putting putting our our our best product forward? We we want to make sure that that's at the forefront of our mind. Uh I think it's people, that's one thing. Um, and the other thing, you know, one of the things that that we we talk about a lot uh on our campus is especially from an athletic standpoint, um, we want to create a great student athlete experience. We want to create a great fan and donor experience, and we want to make sure that we have a first class image uh uh on, you know, as far as a Division I athletics program. And so uh I think it goes back to people taking pride in what we do and and also making sure that we keep those three principles kind of at the forefront of our mind. And you know, you asked Josh about how do you how do you balance um how do you balance doing that for 18 sports? Well, that's tough. That is, that's that's very challenging. We're we're proud of all 18 of our sports and and certainly feel that we have an opportunity to be successful within our conference uh nationally uh within all 18 of our sports. And so we we don't look at one as as greater than the other. We want all all 18 to be successful at the highest level we can be. Um and so it's it's uh continuously keeping keeping uh notes and keeping track and and uh making sure that we're trying to do everything we can from a standpoint of repair, upkeep, or or improving our facility so that that all 18 of our our sports can can maintain that you know opportunity for success.

SPEAKER_03 44:48

Really good. Now let me ask you a question. We we've asked uh several people uh in this growing uh age of AI, how how do you use or do you use AI to benefit your leadership?

SPEAKER_02 45:00

Yeah, uh great, great question, Don. So we've actually kind of uh this year begun to to enter into uh uh a little bit of uh AI use, if you will. And so uh what we're doing it right now on our media relations side. Um we we we joint we partnered with FanWord, you may have heard that company. Um it I believe it's it's been uh it was developed and and and uh at least started by former SIDs. And so um, you know, you think about the storytelling of college athletics or of an athletic department, I think that in and of itself has evolved tremendously over the last 20 years. I mean, you know, I I I and you think about a sports information director and the role that they've had on a on a collegiate athletic campus has really evolved over the last 20 years and in the way that you tell your story. And so it's not just keeping the stats, it's not just you know, post-game reports and and all those things or a preview, a recap. Sure, you get you still got to do those things. Yeah, but now what's what's what's important now too is that creative media, right? It's it's it's um you know your graphics, your videos, and tying all of that together. And so um one of the ways that we've we've really tried to lean into AI, especially this year, is we we we partnered with FanWord. And so the way I've looked at that, Don, is that you know, uh, for the investment that we are making through FanWord and what FanWord is, is it really helps to uh it's an AI tool that helps to streamline a lot of those traditional SID responsibilities, whether that be um game recaps, previews, all those things, those stories that take a lot of time for someone to sit down and write. If we can condense that and and through our investment, I've looked at it as hey, we're adding an additional staff member for a you know, a much smaller investment that that really is still allows us to stay on brand, do things we're trying to do, but free up time for for the folks on our staff. Again, I mentioned we have a we have we have a small staff. There's no doubt we we do, and and and that's but that's who we are, and we're proud of that. But um, you know, so I've I've looked at it as, hey, it's it's a good thing. Now we you got to be careful with it, no doubt. But if you can use that as a resource to free up time uh for some of our staff in other areas so that we can, you know, advance what we're doing, but still stay on brand, still stay within our mission and still really doing what we're trying to do as an athletic department help us grow, I think we're we're we're wise to look at that and and and uh I think you have to in this age.

SPEAKER_03 47:27

Really, really good. Now, kind of uh talking about this age that we talked about, with NIL on the transfer portal, reshaping collegiate athletics on what feels like a daily, maybe even an hourly basis, uh, especially on your end, uh, we're starting to see the ripple effects at the high school level. Um, it's becoming more and more challenging for student athletes to find opportunities to play at the next level. Uh in fact, our overall number of how much commitments, and this is a district where we have roughly 13,000 athletes over 16 schools, has declined in recent years and probably is going to reach a record low this year. And it's not because our student athletes woke up today any less talented or less prepared, but because the landscape above us has fundamentally changed. And I can make justifications for that. But what would you say to a high school student who still dreams of playing college sports as they try to navigate this new and evolving environment? You were a JUCO kid, you were a D2 kid, maybe speak to that track as opposed to what may have been a direct Division I track maybe years ago. What would you tell that kid?

SPEAKER_02 48:35

Yeah. That's great, great question. I think in in short, I would say don't lose sight of your dream and never give up on your dream. Um, you know, I I think you're right. I mean, Don, that the the landscape has shifted so much. I mean, we had, you know, National Signing Day was last Wednesday, unless my my dates are wrong. I think all the weeks run together right now. But so we announced 42 signees within our football program uh here at Central Arkansas. And so um, you know, it but I I think back to what National Signing Day was when I was coming out of high school as a student athlete, and you know, had several you know teammates that I played high school football with that that signed uh to play collegiate football. I played baseball, but you know, so on and so forth. And so National Signing Day was almost like uh, I mean, it was it was kind of like a I mean it was a holiday, if you will. It was a big deal.

SPEAKER_03 49:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:25

It was a big deal, right? And so, you know, I I was as we were going through last week, I was thinking about that. I think we actually signed four student athletes on National Signing Day. A lot of the work had been done before, and so between, you know, mid-year enrollees that were high school signees, you had, you know, we we signed some division two transfers, we signed some um, we signed some uh uh junior college kids at before, you know, January. And we also the the way the transfer portal changed for Division I football this year, we we had a lot of work to do in that January 2nd through 16th range, which was that that that that's a uh for another day, another time. But um, you know, it's it's it's different. You're right. And and I I I'm I'm certainly following all the impact it's having on on uh high school athletics, but I think I would tell a student athlete that you know don't lose sight of your dream, work hard, do everything you can. In this day and age, you also have so many more tools at your disposal to one, connect with with folks that could help you in that process, but also, you know, as far as like sharing even film of yourself and and having access to those things, you know, I I think you do have to work a little harder to get yourself in front of some of those some of those folks. But I think, you know, also some of the ripple effect with the transfer portal is while this can be seen as a good thing, as a bad thing, it's created some opportunity for movement from division to division as young people develop in their their collegiate career. And and and you know, we we've been fortunate here at Central Arkansas to really uh over the last few years have some have some you know student athletes that have maybe went to Division II uh out of out of high school and and participate and have a chance to move up. And one of a great success story here at Central Arkansas, we had a defensive end uh a couple years ago is a kid from Stuttgart, Arkansas uh started his career at Southern Arkansas University, Division II came to us, three-time All-American, was the Buck Buchanan uh player of the FCS Defensive Player of the Year was drafted in the fourth round last spring by the uh by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, and just a great story. But I I think that in in addition to don't lose sight of your dream, continue working hard, do everything you can to market yourself, build those relationships, go to the camps, all the things, don't lose sight of that. Um, but also understand that any opportunity to play college athletics is is a cherished opportunity. I mean, I I played you know two years at the junior college level, I played two years at division two. And even my as I stepped into junior college and then division two, I mean it's it's it's it's a different experience. And I had to to kind of really uh uh adjust some of my uh the way I looked at things because of the time, commitment, the work ethic, and all those things. But any opportunity that's out there is is very very valuable and and uh and and all of that. And and and again, kind of the ripple effect with the transfer portal, you know, good, bad, indifferent, whatever, you have some opportunity to still advance your career. Whereas when I was playing, I think you you know you went somewhere, and then you know, for me, I played two years of junior college, then two years of division two. I didn't know what the transfer portal was, right? And so, you know, you have an opportunity to to to even continue to to to market yourself and as you grow during a pivotal time, 18 to 22 years old. But um, so that's uh that's a stab at that, Don. It's a long-winded answer, but but uh uh I certainly think it's important to not lose sight of your dream.

SPEAKER_03 52:43

Yeah, no, I totally agree. I mean, you know, you take what you have and then continue to do what you've just been doing. You you've worked hard to get to that point, just keep doing that, and then that will give you another opportunity. I think that's I think that's the answer. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:56

Yeah, really good, really good stuff. All right, Matt, one more question before we get to our two-minute drill. We read a quote from a sports performance coach who said baseball, and once again, we're baseball people, but baseball is a person-to-person industry. I'd argue the same is true in athletic administration and people may argue in leadership in general. He went on to emphasize that making sure that we have the human connection should be priority number one. From your perspective as a leader, how do you intentionally build and sustain those human connections? What does that actually look like in your day-to-day work?

SPEAKER_02 53:31

Yeah, great question, Josh. I I agree with that. And and I I'm gonna say this first. Um I'm I'm I'm 37 years old, uh, but I and be 38 in April, but but I'm very much an old soul.

SPEAKER_01 53:42

Uh are you the youngest D1 A D now?

SPEAKER_02 53:45

You know, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 53:46

I I'm not I'm not sure. Um I think we had Graham now phone when he was the youngest at one point in time. So yeah. That's right. He was like 15 or something, I think.

SPEAKER_02 53:55

So well, uh, you know, I I think I've gotten a lot more gray hair in the last 18 months or so. So um I'm I'm certainly I feel like I'm aging for sure a lot, lot, a lot quicker than what I was before. But you know, for me, I say that I'm an old soul. I I really love the human interaction piece. I love um I I you know I I I kind of came up in development and um, you know, I think about my experiences in development. I always said that if I I always thought if I could, you know, get in front of somebody or sit across the table for them, whether it'll be over a cup of coffee or uh lunch, I could share what we're trying to do and and and hopefully try to, you know, resonate that with them and and and we could we could get together and and maybe get a gift to support what we're trying to do. And so I I I love that side of it. I really do. I I think you have to. I think it's I think relationships matter in in this business. Um, you know, it's personal. I mean it really is. Not only is it is it that way, and and you know, everybody says it's not not what you know always, it's who you know. I I think I think relationships matter tremendously. And so um I I love the human interaction side of it. I think it's important. Uh certainly try to be present for our staff. I you know, for me, uh again, I mentioned you can get pulled in a lot of different directions in in this this this line of work, but with our staff, I my door is always open and I always always share that. Hey, I want you to come to me with problems. I want to be able to discuss those with you and you know look as at growth opportunities for both of us. And so uh I I think you gotta keep things you know at a personal level. Uh, I think it's how we succeed. Um, I think you have to be present as an athletic director to to be successful with your staff, with your your student athletes, with your coaches, uh, with our donor base and all that. So certainly, you know, uh having those personal relationships, uh, uh uh trying to be as personable as I possibly can uh with with allowing you know access and and all that, uh I certainly it's it's important for me and and I just think it's critical in being successful in this role.

SPEAKER_01 55:55

Man, that's good stuff. I love I loved being present. I think that's a challenge we all need to hear and just just being there for our coaches. So that's good stuff. Matt, thanks a lot for making us better leaders based on your experiences and the lessons you've learned through your uh really short career, uh, but but uh but a fast growing career. So thanks for sharing with us. Uh now Don's gonna kick us off on a two-minute drill and we're gonna get to know you a little bit better.

SPEAKER_03 56:20

All right, Matt, we're gonna hit you with some rapid fire questions. You just tell us the first thing that comes to your mind. Sounds good. What was the first job you ever had ever in your life?

SPEAKER_02 56:29

I worked at the snowball uh shop in Monticello, Arkansas.

SPEAKER_01 56:34

Nice. All right, best place to grab lunch in Conway, Arkansas. I'm gonna go with Mike's place.

SPEAKER_03 56:40

All right, all right. Skydive or swim with sharks?

SPEAKER_02 56:45

Skydive.

SPEAKER_01 56:48

All right, now I saw y'all played in a, I think when he maybe your first year at UCA, you played in the charity golf tournament or the university golf tournament. Y'all played together, but you gotta you weren't the longest driving that, I think. Who's the best golfer in the family though?

SPEAKER_02 57:03

My wife.

SPEAKER_01 57:04

Is it close? What's a handicap?

SPEAKER_02 57:06

You know, it's close. Depends on who you ask. Uh I I love I love the game of golf. And and my wife likes to inform me that, you know, she she doesn't have an opportunity to play anymore because we have a seven-year-old and a four-year-old. And so she said somebody has to watch the kids while you go play golf for four hours. So uh, but I'm gonna answer that it's her because she would she would not be happy if I didn't say anything else.

SPEAKER_03 57:28

Yeah, there you go. Smart man. All right, let's play game.

SPEAKER_01 57:31

I don't hold Josh. Maybe if you say it's you, that gets you back out on the golf course to compete against her. She may she may have taken you out there and it's got to beat you, right?

SPEAKER_02 57:39

That's right, Josh. Chess, not checkers.

SPEAKER_01 57:41

There you go.

SPEAKER_02 57:42

There you go.

SPEAKER_03 57:43

There you go. All right, let's play a game of hot or not. So these are hot takes. So maybe unpopular opinions that you feel strongly about or not. So when we say it, if you agree with it, you say hot. If you disagree with it, you say not. The Ozarks are the most underrated part of the state.

SPEAKER_02 58:01

I'm gonna say not.

SPEAKER_01 58:05

All right, hot or not. Purple and gray is an elite color combo on a turf field. Hot.

SPEAKER_03 58:13

Breakfast for dinner is underrated.

SPEAKER_01 58:17

Not yeah, my son loves the purple food, purple and gray food. Now he soaked that up. All right, last one, hot or not. Toad suck days is a must-attend event. Definitely. So that's hot take, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:32

He agrees. He agrees. All right. So we're asking our guests uh to pick uh a question out of Brett Ledbetter's 365 questions book, okay? So give me a number between one and 365.

SPEAKER_02 58:44

How about 248?

SPEAKER_03 58:47

All right. There's not an easy question in here, by the way. If you had a reminder you put on your mirror for yourself to see every morning, what would it say and why?

SPEAKER_02 59:01

I think I would go to uh my my favorite Bible verse is Colossians 3.23. And so, um, and it's whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, is working for the Lord, not for men.

SPEAKER_01 59:13

That's good. Perfect. Yes, sir. That's uh that might be the easiest question in that book, actually. What was that? 243? If I get that's a question.

SPEAKER_03 59:21

248, I think it's 248.

SPEAKER_01 59:23

That's what I'm picking here. I I I could have done that one. All right, so I know you're from Arkansas, but there's a lot of famous people from Oklahoma. Who's your favorite native of Oklahoma? Oklahoma. You know.

SPEAKER_02 59:40

That's a good question. I'm gonna say Mickey Mantle.

SPEAKER_01 59:45

That's a great answer.

SPEAKER_03 59:46

That's a great answer.

SPEAKER_01 59:47

Yeah, great answer. We were just making sure it wasn't Dustin Smith.

SPEAKER_03 59:51

We didn't want Dustin to be the answer.

SPEAKER_01 59:53

Dustin's a close second. There you go. Close. Exactly the same, but much different. All right, uh, let's finish with this. It's a trademark question. Today, Matt Whiting, you've been hanging with EAD, but let's say you can hang out with anyone. Who would that be and why?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:10

You know, I I'm I'm gonna say, I'm gonna say my wife. I just appreciate how she keeps me grounded uh and and and you know, really keeps things in line for our family. Just enjoy our time together and and uh just grateful for for all that she does for us.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:28

Good deal. Good answer. Strong answer once again, smart man. Matt, we always appreciate our counterparts at the collegiate level taking time to sit down with us as we look to use what you guys are doing to improve our practice at the high school level. Thanks again for the time.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:41

Thank you guys. I sure enjoyed it. What a great conversation with Matt Whiting, Director of Athletics for University of Central Arkansas. It was a pleasure to get to meet Matt. Uh obviously I mentioned that I was able to visit their campus and see just what a uh fantastic place Central Arkansas is. And you can tell they have a genuine, fantastic leader in charge there of the athletic program. And Matt, uh, you know, he he just filled our cup today, and it was great to have him on the show. Three takeaways from what Matt shared today that I will give you. Uh, you probably have your own, and your papers are probably full of notes like mine. But Matt talked about having true Norse. I think having those true Norse, having that compass is really, really, really valuable. When we asked Matt about truth tellers, he was quick to throw out several people in his life. And I think that is a testament to his leadership and his growth mindset. So, who are your truth tellers in your life? And Matt shared several of those. And then I love the conversation around making the best decision for the institution. Sometimes that's a hard decision, sometimes that's hard conversations. A lot of times, the easy decisions and conversations are not the right ones. And Matt talked through that to help us grow in that area. So, Matt, thanks for being with us today. We enjoyed meeting you, getting to know you, and we look forward to tracking the success of the University of Central Arkansas Bears under your leadership there. Thanks for listening today. If you made it this far, we appreciate it. We would love for you to give us a star rating or review on the uh podcast platform you're listening to. And as always, thank you for spending your time hanging with the ADs.